Until Mythic release information on how contribution is calculated we have only theories to figure out how it works, and it truly is a mystery. But if we would imagine that contribution was perfectly calculated, is the system with contribution + roll perfect as it is or should it focus more on one of them, or maybe exclusively one?
What are the positive and negative effects with the different systems?
Contribution
If contribution matters most you will have people turning their characters into the most effective. Gear, Mastery points and abilities will all be tuned for maximum contribution. In a sense this is already happening, but on a slightly smaller scale than if rolls would be thrown out completely - people don’t have to beat everyone else to have a chance for the best bags.
Positive: players are putting a real effort into finding the best role their career has and fulfilling it to the maximum. It’s done for selfish reasons but it’s also good for the team.
Negative: having one Mastery path that is better (at contribution) than others will result in players feeling forced to go that path, both to get loot and to succumb to group pressure. Just like Retribution Paladins in WoW often get yelled at for hitting stuff and not healing. Players will simply play for numbers, not for fun.
Rolls
On the other hand if rolls are most important the random factor that decide who gets loot will be big. Someone who enters the fight at the last minute will have the same chance as getting loot as the one who has worked on it for 30 minutes.
Positive: big random factor means everyone has a chance on getting the top loot, no matter if they are outgeared and outplayed by other players. You will most likely not see the same person getting six gold bags in one day (happened to me).
Negative: drama. People will feel they contribute way more than the other guy who just stood in a corner the entire fight will see top loot land in the hands of the “undeserving”. In MMO games loot is a big thing and the biggest of dramas has come from the smallest of items going into the “wrong” hands. What’s the purpose of sweating blood and tears if all your work doesn’t matter when the loot is handed out?
Decide
So what is the perfect system? The one we got right now (up to 500 contribution and 1-1000 roll) or should the result be determined more for contribution or rolls? Maybe only one of them?
I got a poll to the right I would love if you participated in. Feel free to add a comment if you want to explain your choice.
Dune Messiah
Elminster in Myth Drannor
I don’t voted on the poll, because I think that the current system is not perfect, but ok and doesn’t need a shift to more roll or more contribution.
50% contribtion-bonus is nice enough, it just has to be more transparent why I get my amount of “contribution”.. I don’t want a crystal ball for guessing it, though at the end of the day I don’t care if I’ve won anything as long I had my fun..maybe I’m too relaxed about loot.. ;)
I didn’t vote either. What I feel would work better is doing away with the current loot award…Keep the contribution AND the roll…but instead of awarding loot to the top X players…set the loot up by value….so if your roll + contribution is
> 1400 = purple bag
> 1200 and 900 and 750 and < 900 = green bag
< 750 = no loot
(Of course these numbers were pulled from thin air and would need to be tweaked)
That way you benefit alot from contributing (only way to get purple or blue)…and you may get gear with a lucky roll…but most importantly…you didn’t take the loot from someone who contributed with a lucky roll which is the main problem anyway. If it was independent of other players rolls you would have something to shoot for…and no reason to complain.
Correction on one those numbers (It ate some of my greater/less than signs…doh)
more than 1400 = purple bag
more than 1200 and less than 1401 = blue bag
more than 900 and less then 1201 = gold bag
more than 750 and less than 901 = green bag
less than 751 = no loot
I voted for ‘more weight on contribution’. It gives incentive to those who work towards the goal, and spec’d/geared carefully while also giving those who aren’t a chance.
I have to say I hate the current system. In keep battle for example; About all I can do is run the ram or by the second door I have nothing to do but try to nail stragglers. Once at the lord, unless I get a rez I can be knocked out of the fight quick. And yet I was there the whole time and I fought hard. I am level 35 and yet a level 40 beats me with contribution ..i understand that. I roll very well and I can’t pass the loot. He got a metal and I got loot …his metal is worth nothing.
Here is my suggestion …if you contribute more in battle you should get HUGE bonus on renown …at a minimum you get the metal bonus that could be turned in at a warcamp.
the fact the the roll currently has a value up to double that of the max contribution bonus means the emphasis is heavily weighted in that - Random - direction and as we’ve all seen means that you can get little or no contribution bonus but a good roll and win. I think even just reducing the roll to between 1 and 600 would make the system fairer and mean that the contribution had moreof an effect. sure someone who got a gold medal - 500 points could still only get a low roll and come 3rd or 4th but the chances of this would be greatly reduced. And the players who turn up late to help out or are not contributing will still have a chance to get some loot bags - therefore you could leave the no. of bags won the same but the system would reward the right people…. what do you think?
“players are putting a real effort into finding the best role their career has and fulfilling it to the maximum”
Not from what I’ve seen. Players are putting a real effort into finding what gives them the most contribution. If that seems to be not doing anything other than hitting the Lord once as a DPS class (I can’t make this up), they’ll only hit the Lord once. That actually is detrimental to the group as a whole.
Contribution is a good idea, but I think it needs to be less transparent as Zizlak said. That way we as players can know when we’re doing things correctly and when we’re doing them wrong.
Keep the current system but make it more transparent - like the leaderboard at the end of a scenario. Also - put in a way to pass on a bag. I know this has great potential to be abused but this isn’t such a gear-centric game like WoW so it shouldn’t matter. This way, if I, at the upper end of the Tier range, happen upon and help a group trying to complete a PQ, I can pass on gear I won’t need. Win-Win situation for all involved.
Ventris: What’s the potential for abuse on a pass system?
The current system is the best solution. It makes everybody unhappy. When one group is happy and one group is unhappy you know somethings wrong with your loot distribution! :)
The problem is, the contribution system does not work.
There was a recent example of a chicken getting top contribution.
Even if it was not completely broken, and I know opinions differ on whether it is or not, different actions are weighted differently. think of all the different ways people can contribute during a Keep Siege. There are the obvious things like doing damage, healing, and tanking. But also you have the people who actually bring the rams, organise the troops, keep the enemy players off the backs of the folks fighting the Lord.
As an Engineer, for instance, I am treated harshly even by a non-bugged contribution system. I don’t heal, I certainly don’t tank, and I’m not going to be out-damaging a lot of folks. I do root, I throw our foes off the battlements, and I protect our healers with my life. These things are not really rewarded by the contribution system, and it would be very difficult to programme one that did give proper credit for all possible actions that help the goal.
In my opinion, the only thing you can do is assume that everyone present is doing the best job that they can, which is, if we’re honest, usually true. Nobody is not going to try to help. That being the case I would remove the current contribution mechanism. Perhaps you could instead simply give a bonus for being there from the beginning instead of turning up at the keep late. Because our classes are, by their nature, unequal, the contribution system is inherently unfair.
I dont mind the system as is and thats what I’ve voted, but there is a need for a ‘pass’ button certainly.
Usually I win nothing on keep sieges as lag alone slows me down badly (I am a DPS class), but after umpteen keep sieges I have won a gold bag twice in succession. I figure 2 bags out of 30+ keep sieges is not unreasonable but now I dont want to win again in this tier as I have both the set piece and the purple item. So a pass button is pretty essential!